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July 3, 2012
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:iconarchosaurian:
Here we have four dromæosaurid skulls, and all except for the top and bottom ones belong to their own genus. They come from almost the same time and place and the differences between them are no greater than infrageneric differences in many other taxa, *and* recent cladistic studies place them all in the same clade, so why don't we just say that clade is the genus and be done with all these extra names (and rather stupid sounding names at that, one follows the formula place-name-raptor, the other is a post-modern Norrell name where the species name only makes sense when paired up with the name of the genus for which it is the type).
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:iconqilong:
With Turner et al.'s recent monograph - here: [link] - there is now the (relatively strong?) suggestion that Linheraptor exqisitus is a junior synonym of Tsaagan mangas, but that the latter differs substantially enough from Velociraptor mongoliensis or osmolskae.
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:iconpaleo-king:
~Paleo-King Nov 24, 2012  Professional Traditional Artist
Even though I find myself splitting more often than lumping, there's no denying these things ALL look like Velociraptor (well maybe except #2 with its thicker snout, but that one still smells like Velociraptor). Skulls #1 and #3 look practically identical, I'd put them in the same species in addition to the same genus! Go ahead and lump them, I won't be offended. After a while all the little notch-snouted raptors begin to look the same to me anyway.

But part of this is also my anti-theropod prejudices kicking in.

I find it ridiculous that theropod experts (specifically when it comes to the little birdy ones) make so many little hair-splitting distinctions between this raptor and that raptor, this parave and that parave, when so many of them look identical. And yet they have no problem with referring to Giraffatitan as "Brachiosaurus" brancai or with lumping Haplocanthosaurus into Suwassea or some other diplodocid. Paleontology as a whole has this problem, of splitting little birdy creatures known from plenty of complete, nearly identical slab-fossilized specimens into innumerable species and subgenera, but lumping far larger creatures together which have far more obvious differences between them on the basis of "ontogeny" or "regional variation". There's more variation between Sauroposeidon and Paluxysaurus for a single vertebra position than you see comparatively in the entire bodies of any two of these raptors! Yet in their infinite genius the various fan-radiated throngs of neo-Hornerite pseudo-mavericks go around lumping the amazingly huge and splitting the underwhelmingly small (and the bigger the dinosaur, the more room for variation and different morphologies in the specimen). It's no longer restricted to one person or school of colleagues, now it's like an epidemic that's raging out of control under many different names, the hypocritical splitting of anything little and fuzzy on the most minute of differences, and lumping of most things big and scaly on the basis of far scantier similarities. We have some folks at SVP trying to argue that Utahceratops is nothing more than a mature form of Kosmoceratops (and not being tactful about it either), meanwhile Maniraptoran species seem to be multiplying and fragmenting faster than evangelical church denimonations!

Seriously, when will folks decide how much of this kool-aid is enough? It's not a stretch to say that half of SVP would split Shaq and Danny DeVito into different genera if given the chance.
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:iconkazuma27:
~Kazuma27 Jul 9, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Frankly, i'd lump 'em all in Velociraptor and call it a day (not a fan either of over-splitting genera).
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:iconbrandonspilcher:
*BrandonSPilcher Apr 23, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Same here. Velociraptor is the genus everyone recognizes anyway.
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:icondeinonychusempire:
~DeinonychusEmpire Jul 4, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
I'm a bit of a lumper, myself.
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:iconghostinthepines:
~GhostInThePines Jul 4, 2012  Hobbyist Photographer
I like your way of thinking on this... there are so many animals that fall under the same genus despite major differences between species. It does seem stupid to separate dromaeosaurids into so many different genuses. I think the main obsticle to reworking any dinosaur names to reflect how living species are classified, though, is the fact that for many dinosaur species, the genus also stands in as the common name of the animal... this leads me to figure that species names get dropped a lot in conversations even of a professional nature. "Wildlifers" don't exactly have the same mix-up issues with scientific vs common name usage.
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:iconpilsator:
~pilsator Jul 4, 2012  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
Beautiful work, Mike.

I'd say the point for them being non-congeneric is that they do not form a clade to the exclusion of all other dromaeosaurids in most analyses (i.e., all but Senter et al. (2012) and some glimpses at Andrea Cau's megamatrix). Intuitively, I'm at a loss for words how they could be parts of different lineages with some 70 million years of convergent evolution making them end up almost the same, but that's an argument from incredulity; the current Senter et al. and Cau matrices, being better sampled than earlier iterations, make a much better case for that.

Honestly, I've given up pretending that genera are real and that we should follow a crown bird- or mammal-like genericometer in non-avialan dinosaurs, but you just make me wish to do some lumping and splitting again :D
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:iconemperordinobot:
You know I agree that these are all Velociraptor.

Probably different subspecies, but Velociraptor.
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:iconzegh8578:
Also, we're dealing with animals in a "4D" landscape, that is, the same place, but across time. It is obvious these are all very closely related, despite what differences they have, they show clear signs of being of "the same stock", which is precisely why distinct genera seem so redundant.
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:iconzegh8578:
Distinct taxa, yes, but I must agree that these wouldn't cause any headaches by falling under Velociraptor. Probably less headaches than split up as separate genera...
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